Well, if you drive a car … you’re likely starting to feel the pressure of the rising gas prices. This has been pushing people to start looking at hybrid vehicles. I had done the math loosely in my head before and realized it would take a very long life expectancy for your hybrid car to have it really make sense financially. Well, I was recently talking to a friend who was considering purchasing a hybrid car so I sat down real fast and made a calculator to compare the cost of two cars along with the cost of gas for both cars. After doing so, I looked up the mileage and sticker prices on some cars. I drive a Honda Civic, and I consider it a relatively nice car. It also happens to have a hybrid model in production so I felt it would be pretty good for testing out the tool. Below are links to a couple of comparisons that I ran. Needless to say I found that the loose calculations I did in my head were not accurate. Unfortunately it’s worse then I realized.
Basically what I found was that if you compare the EX to the Hybrid, it takes roughly 200,000 miles for the hybrid to start saving you money. If you’re willing to drive the DX model, even after 400,000 miles, the hybrid hasn’t started to save you money.
Obviously this tool has a couple of “flaws” I should probably point out. For one, it assumes that gasoline cost per gallon will stay the same throughout the mileage/cost projection. Also it obviously doesn’t take into account maintenance costs on the cars, but I think this is ok since regardless of which one you were to choose, maintenance costs would be incurred. Third, gas prices obviously vary based on your location, so that would impact the time it would take to start saving money. Even given these faults, I still think it illustrates the point, even if it’s not 100% accurate.
Honda Civic Sedan EX vs Honda Civic Sedan Hybrid
Honda Civic Sedan LX vs Honda Civic Sedan Hybrid
Honda Civic Sedan DX vs Honda Civic Sedan Hybrid
UPDATE: In fairness to Honda, I suppose I should mention that my calculations were based on Highway mileage. If you want to see the difference just adjust Car 2 down to 30MPG on each of the above examples (Hybrid city mileage doesn’t change significantly, the Civic hybrid gas mileage on the sticker is 49/51). It does make a difference, but not until roughly 200,000 miles on the DX.
UPDATE: Sorry the links no longer work, the application I wrote to do the math was lost somewhere along the way when I switched webhosts. I’m leaving this post here though because the content is still true.
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I wouldn’t worry about the maintenance cost in your assumptions. From what I understand, maintenance costs are more on the hybrid and you can’t get it serviced at all service locations so it would only make it take longer to have it pay for itself thus only strenghtening your point.
Yeah, I assumed the same thing as you’re both saying regarding maintenance costs. But I hadn’t done any research into it, so I didn’t want to base much of my argument on it.
I also agree with what you are saying Jeremy in regard to this being a “solution” within the oil paradigm. You’re exactly right, we need to get outside the box on this problem to find a real, working solution.
I think you’re right… I’m not buying a more efficient car till they actually invent one :-)
And I think people are far underestimating the maintenance costs of a hybrid. This isn’t a different car, it’s a completely different kind of machine! I doubt even the dealers’ mechanics are very good at repairing them, let alone understanding them.
Right now all this hybrid fad is is an image, not any substantive step in the right direction. The only upside is that it will start to create a market for sustainable transportation options. The sad part is that it perpetuates the myth that we can do this within the oil paradigm. We’re gonna have to start thinking WAY outside the box, not just designing new cars.
And Toyota and the other hybrid manufacturers are having the same problems as Honda.
Yeah, I assumed the same thing as you’re both saying regarding maintenance costs. But I hadn’t done any research into it, so I didn’t want to base much of my argument on it.
I also agree with what you are saying Jeremy in regard to this being a “solution” within the oil paradigm. You’re exactly right, we need to get outside the box on this problem to find a real, working solution.
I left Matt a message about this yesterday.. they’re not huge credits, but $3,400 is nothing to sneeze at.
Taken from the Department of Energy (http://www.energy.gov/taxbreaks.htm)
Automobile Tax Credits
Individuals and businesses who buy or lease a new hybrid gas-electric car or truck are eligible for, and can receive, an income tax credit of $250-$3,400 ÇÏ depending on the fuel economy and the weight of the vehicle. Hybrid vehicles that use less gasoline than the average vehicle of similar weight and that meet an emissions standard qualify for the credit. Ç?Lean-burnÇ? diesel vehicles could also qualify, but currently available diesel vehicles do not meet the emissions standard. There is a similar credit for alternative-fuel vehicles and for fuel-cell vehicles.
If you qualified for the $3400 credit, it would even things out between the EX vs the Hybrid, however on a DX, it still wouldn’t touch it basically.
They really need to find a way to sky-rocket the MPG, or lower the cost of the Hybrid significantly, or, as Jeremy suggests, look to an entirely different way of fixing the problem.
I think Civic vs. Civic, you’re right, the difference isn’t worth the expense. But average hybrid gas mileage compared to average compact car gas mileage and it might change a bit. I would think.
Jason, that is true. It will be different with every car you compare. But then again, that’s why I made the calculator ;) I don’t think the point being made will change vastly however regardless of the comparison you make (excluding of course comparing the hybrid to say … a Hummer).
While we all sit and wait for the perfect non-oil-based solution, why not start by taking a step in the right direction?
Sure, it might cost us in financial terms, but you know what they say here in the US: “put your money where your mouth is!”
I think the corporations could do a lot better then they are at present AC, and they sure have a lot more money then I do…
I think hybrids are just an excuse to make more money on the tree huggers.
I Think I’ll stick to my 100$ truck that has 12 MPG but never has to be fixed. Blaizers are sweet!
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